Joe Gandleman has a niece piece on the upcoming fall elections. The quote that stood out for me was this one.
I’ve long predicted that much will depend on GOP rhetorical overreach: if it gets to the point where Democrats rush to the polls due to polemics and the results are far less than the GOP expected on election day than Michael Steel and other party establishment bigwigs will be on the defensive.
If the GOP wants to see major gains and possibly take back the House in the fall, they will need to stop saying things like this.
“Nazis don’t have the right to put up a sign next to the Holocaust Museum in Washington,” Mr. Gingrich said on the Fox News program “Fox and Friends.” “We would never accept the Japanese putting up a site next to Pearl Harbor. There’s no reason for us to accept a mosque next to the World Trade Center.”
While this certainly fires up the base of the GOP, this kind of language (in addition to being filled with flaws), alienates independent voters. It also fires up the soft vote that Michael Moore talked about in the clip I put up last week. Certainly, it demonstrates an intolerance that could turn off a wide variety of demographics.
Let's take a look at some key facts:
1. The Planned Site is NOT on Ground Zero but is two blocks away. Two blocks away is not sacred or hallowed ground. Again, not the attack site but an ordinary block in lower Manhattan. I guess my question would be...how many blocks away is respectful?
2. It is not simply a Mosque. It is a community center with meeting rooms and a pool that offers more privacy to conform to religious restrictions. There is also going to be an auditorium for lectures.
3. Our Constitution guarantees freedom of religion and private property. If you vociferously defend the Constitution, as many in the GOP do every day, than you must defend the right for them to build their center there. To be against this Mosque would be incongruous if one claimed to be a defender of the Constitution.
As most of you know, I have a horrible prejudice against Muslim men. But the outrage over this is ridiculous. If anything, we need to show the world how tolerant we are and embrace them. This would demonstrate a clear separation between those who believe in the basic principles of freedom and tolerance (us) and those who do not (Hirabis).
And it is a stark example of Gandelman's rhetorical overreach. If I were a GOP strategist, I would tell them to get back to talking about the economy and jobs. That's where their greatest hope for victory lies.
13 comments:
So it's not what democrats do, it's what republicans say. Dream on - that's just what you HOPE the election hinges on.
While this certainly fires up the base of the GOP...
Actually, from what I'm seeing it's alienating as many as it's firing up. Even those who oppose it admit they have a right to build there, so far as I can tell.
My personal take on it:
Is it a deliberate provocation? Almost certainly.
Is it hateful and shitty? Almost certainly.
Is it deeply disrespectful of the dead? Almost certainly.
Does that mean we can (or should) stop it? Well if people being hateful, shitty, provocative and disrespectful of the dead in the name of their religion was grounds for such stuff, Westboro Baptist Church wouldn't still exist, now would it?
And even if you assume that it is, in fact, a case of "Islam builds mosques at the site of victories", that it is in fact a deliberate poke in the eye of the US... okay, so what? That makes this mosque nothing but extreme childishness writ very large (again, much like Westboro Baptist). If you assume we're adult enough to govern ourselves, it shouldn't be too big a stretch to think we're grown up enough to treat such childishness as what it is.
Put the mosque in and put the gay bar right next to it.
We'll soon see who is tolerant.
There are already two mosques nearby: one is four blocks away from the site and the other 12 blocks away. Both were there before 9/11. Both are overcrowded, so it's only logical that another one would open. This is an issue only because guys like Newt Gingrich want to sow fear and hate for political gain, and don't care what kind of damage they do to the country.
Though Newt mentioned the Japanese and Pearl Harbor, he obviously didn't do his homework. There's a Shinto shrine less than five miles away from Pearl Harbor. The Izumo Taishakyo Mission has existed for about a century. It was shut down during WWII, but was reopened in 1968. Oahu has lots of Japanese gardens and Buddhist temples.
When the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor they killed a lot of Japanese Americans too, because a lot of Americans of Japanese descent lived in Hawaii at that time. Just like the 9/11 bombers killed a lot of Muslim Americans who worked in the towers.
By Gingrich's logic, we shouldn't allow any Southern Baptist churches in northern states because of the egregious harm caused by the Confederacy. We shouldn't allow Anglican churches in the US because Tory sympathizers might use them to plot the overthrow of the American Revolution. And we should close all Catholic churches near playgrounds because priests might prey on the children.
When you come right down to it, we should shut down every church, mosque and temple, because every religion has adherents who have committed murder and even genocide in the name of God.
Penalizing American Muslims for the crimes of foreign fanatics is wrong. By declaring war on Islam, instead criminals responsible for terrorist actions, Gingrich is confirming the worst fears of American Muslims. This will only serve to convince American Muslims that fanatics were right after all. Just as the war in Iraq was the best recruiting tool Al Qaeda had, Gingrich is providing them yet another.
It's obvious that people who oppose the mosque have not done their homework, or have any interest in fairness, law, justice or morality. They simply wish to inflame the hatred of their core supporters to bring out the vote in the next election. It's all about turnout!
You can almost forgive the lesser lights like Sarah Palin for their ignorance and spitefulness. But Newt Gingrich is a smart guy, and he knows that he's simply spewing mendacious hate. And he just sits there and lies, just like he did at Clinton's impeachment hearing over the Monica Lewinski thing. Yeah, the one during which Gingrich was having an affair with an aide, who eventually became his third wife.
RLD--it's what the Democrats aren't doing that is the problem. Some of us liberals think that the president hasn't gone far enough in many of his policies. He's also pursued a policy in Afghanistan that seems pointless. What can we actually do there? Perhaps you are right, though. It is what he is doing which is not progressive. I think you are mistaking the outrage as being exclusively right wing.
Some of us liberals think that the president hasn't gone far enough in many of his policies.
Yep, and you are the ones I am going to laugh hardest at when the chickens come home to roost.
"This is an issue only because guys like Newt Gingrich want to sow fear and hate for political gain, and don't care what kind of damage they do to the country." - blk
Interesting take but not even close. In fact, since over 70% of America agrees with Newt, your conclusion is ridiculous. 70% of America isn't running for political office.
"By declaring war on Islam, instead criminals responsible for terrorist actions, Gingrich is confirming the worst fears of American Muslims." - blk
Wow, so Gingrich saying it is insensitive to build so close to ground zero (not banning islam) is equated to declaring war on Islam. This is such a stretch that even plastic man couldn't span than chasm.
"t's obvious that people who oppose the mosque have not done their homework, or have any interest in fairness, law, justice or morality" - blk
It is apparent that those who complain about those opposed to the mosque are ignorant and can't figure out the basics of an argument. Very similar to the illegal immigration debate that you morons continue to confuse illegal immigration with all immigration.
Let's look at some key facts:
"1. The planned site is NOT on Ground Zero but is two blocks away. Two blocks away is not sacred or hallowed ground." - M
You got a fact right, not on ground zero. Then you spew an opinion as a fact. Nice try. You may not think it is hallowed ground but many Americans find this area a bit sensitive. Do I know how far would be acceptable? no. But that close, within the shadow of the towers seems to be too close for most people. If you have no emotional connection to that, then don't denigrate the majority that do.
"2. It is not simply a Mosque. Blah blah blah" - M
So what? It still is a mosque and a just because there are other things in it means nothing. They could put an amusement park in there too and it wouldn't make a difference. The basic point from number 1 still stands. This has no bearing.
"3. Our Constitution guarantees freedom of religion and private property" - M
Yes, and nobody is contesting it on those grounds. NOBODY. So who are you arguing against? Point me to a statement by Newt or Palin saying what you continue to push.
Will this be overplayed by the GOP? Maybe, but right now, a vast majority are agreeing with that position and the left continue to misrepresent the issue. That isn't playing well at all.
You can almost forgive the lesser lights like Sarah Palin for their ignorance and spitefulness. But Newt Gingrich is a smart guy, and he knows that he's simply spewing mendacious hate.
And yet somehow you didn't get around to calling Harry Reid on it. Ain't it amazing how that works?
Oh, and as an aside...
Things like this are why so many libertarian types and tea partiers consider it insulting when you conflate them with the GOP base. One of the most fundamental principles of the tea party is that corrupt Republicans who don't let the law stand in the way of their agenda aren't any improvement over corrupt Democrats who don't let the law stand in the way of theirs.
This is an issue only because guys like Newt Gingrich want to sow fear and hate for political gain, and don't care what kind of damage they do to the country.
But of course what Nancy Pelosi is doing bears no resemblance at all to 'sowing fear and hate for political gain', does it?
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0810/41204.html
It's all about the rights of the Muslims... but the people who oppose it, including Muslims... well, they should be investigated.
I wonder when they're going to get around to investigating Nancy Pelosi's shady deals and connections?
Silly me, never of course.
How many blocks from the Kaaba must I be to build our new Baptist church and cultural center?
Pelosi wants to investigate Americans? Markadelphia would have had a problem with that in 2007. Now it's 2010 and it gets no attention. And no, THEY need to show the world how tolerant THEY are, not us.
we're told on here that the gop is guilty of overreach and need to move left and the democrats aren't progressive enough. At the same time Harry Reid lurches to the right and opposes the mosque being built at the proposed site. you guys are just dumb. hahahahaha
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