This past weekend, I was at my gym working out as I often am. Up sauntered the merry little band of true believers that hang out with me and BS politics. We have the doctor (Sean), the evangelical pastor (Edward), the retired gym teacher (Katie) and the female body builder (Erica). Erica is married to a one of the chief Tea Partiers in Minnesota and actually used to be super liberal. But she married him and suddenly she was super conservative. I guess it's not surprising. After all, she simply traded one naive idealistic viewpoint for another.
I've talked about these folks for quite some time using different names but the names I listed above (not the real ones, obviously) are going to stay the same from now on. They've said too many "wonderful" things over the years that it's high time I got more organized and used them as demonstrative characters. Granted, they aren't representative of the whole of the conservative movement but they do say things that echo many of the things I hear on here all the time. In essence, they are the perfect true believers. More importantly, they are testimonials to the effect that there are no voices inside my head:)
This last conversation got into spending right away. Edward made his usual comments about Social Security being a Ponzi scheme (he doesn't even say "like" a Ponzi Scheme anymore), Sean was his usual rage filled self hating everything Obama does, and Katie had quite a bit to say about Planned Parenthood (all they do is provide abortions) as well as the "drive by" media. Erica didn't really say much but threw in a comment about libtards before she left.
It was right after this that the following conversation occurred.
Katie: It scares me to death that you teach our children, Mark.
Me: Why?
Katie: Because you are a communist.
Me: I'm not a communist.
Katie: Yes, you are. The things you say...you are a communist.
Me: No, I assure you I'm a capitalist. And it's not my job to share my opinions when I'm in class. I'm more interested in my students' opinions and moving them to a higher level on Bloom's Taxonomy. It's enough work to get them to pay attention, be inspired, and get their work done.
Katie: But you can't help it, though. Your ideas just ooze out...you are a communist...and it frightens me that you teach our children.
Katie was adamant and there was really no convincing her that I wasn't a commie so I told her to try not to let fear rule her life and think a little more critically about politics. She then started going off about GE paying no taxes and Obama being in their back pocket which I actually took as a sign of progress as well as further proof that their is some potential for common ground between someone like me and her. But then she went back to personally insulting me and screaming about taking our country back so I went off to do some cardio.
The whole exchange, especially the end where she angrily called for taking our country back, made me think of a scenario which I'm going to throw out to all of you. I'm certainly going to present her with it as well at some point. I started to reflect on her statements and realized that she was directing most of her venom at me (a teacher) and the media. Whenever folks narrow their rage at the those two outlets of information, I can't help but think about how those were items #1 and #2 on the list in Germany circa 1933. So, here's my scenario.
Suppose a candidate comes along named John Smith. He is the living embodiment of a perfect conservative. He is your ideal candidate. Now, I know we have some variation with conservatives here so each of you imagine your perfect guy. This guy has the backing a very large group of people and is accumulating so much support that he has enough power to run the country exactly how you want him to run it. In other words, there are enough like minded people for him to run the country as a single and authoritative body.
Given that he embodies perfectly your ideology, would you support him in this endeavor? Be honest. Remember, he is going to do everything you want him to do. He has "taken the country back" and is carrying your ideology into action. I'll put up what I would do tomorrow.
17 comments:
It already happened in Wisconsin. Republicans took both houses and the governorship, and they immediately and viciously attacked teachers and public sector unions, essentially revoking their right to organize. The Republicans' goal appears to be nothing less than the total destruction of organized labor, and wholesale takeover of state government by private industry.
Obama and the Democrats won a similar electoral victory in 2008 (screwy Senate rules made a real "takeover" impossible, because of the delay in seating Franken and Kennedy's death). The result? A rather mild health care plan that Mitt Romney, Bob Dole and the majority of Republican Party would have endorsed wholeheartedly 10 or 15 years ago. New consumer protections and financial regulations that are rather weak in light of the disasters of the real estate bubble. An extension of the Bush tax cuts. Expanded offshore drilling. More emphasis on nuclear power. (The last two have lost their luster since the Gulf spill and the typhoon in Japan.)
There have been no civil trials of Guantanamo detainees, curtailing of gun ownership (even in light of the horrific events in Arizona), or any of the dire predictions the right spouted when Obama was elected.
Now, which is the party of doctrinaire power-grubbing maniacs intent on stripping Americans of their rights and forcing their will on the people?
If there were a John Smith with whom I agree on everything, there is no way I would support his authoritarian regime. This would be true if he was completely benevolent. There is always the possibility that he could be wrong about things. I know I am and don't have so much vanity to think that I'm right about everything political either.
Been awhile. Good to be back. Mark, your friend Katie is a closet fascist. Many on the right are this way even though butt wipes like Goldberg has tried to play hide the nut. Fascism has always meant right wing. They claim to want less government but when they get into power they want everyone to think and do exactly as they do. This is why they wrongly assume that liberals are "forcing them to do things" and "ramming things down their throats." That's how they see the world just as you have said many times.
It's clear what her answer would be. Don't be surprised when she volunteers to goose step along with her benevolent leader.
I don't suppose any of these allegedly real people know about your blog and/or are willing to confirm what you say about them? If not, as far as I am concerned, yes - they are only voices in your head.
In contrast you have plenty of people that do post here that don't agree with you - without the cartoon Nazism. Yet who do you choose to talk with/about?
My fifth grade daughter has a teacher that won't shut up about the WI budget bill. Every other day she comes home with a doozy of a statement that Mrs D spouts off.
It was good fodder over the dinner table, but truth be told, I'm really sick and tired of it. Because we talk politics in my house, my daughter recognizes that her teacher isn't giving any time at all to the other side of the story.
And she's been busy circulating a petition (on school grounds, during the school day) to recall one of the Repubes.
And I've had enough. But rather than just send an irate email, or go above her head and tattle on her, I got creative and offered to come into the classroom to debate her on the issue.
This would be a great opportunity for her to demonstrate her sides' superiority and put a TEA Partier in the proverbial headlock and give me a death roll, no?
No.
She's no havin' any.
Would you entertain such an invitation from a parent?
Somewhat surprisingly, M did not produce the most monumental crap on the Internet today, E.J.Dionne did:
"Noblesse oblige" sounds bad until it doesn't exist anymore.
Personally I say fuck off to anyone who thinks they are obliged to ennoble my blighted existence. What a colossal load of self serving horseshit.
Oh, and M, you were wondering about Democrat nanny-statism? What do you say to Obama's DOJ assault on online poker playing? Or are you one of those God-fearing assholes that hates that particular vice?
Anon, I completely agree with you about that teacher. She is absolutely wrong for using her class as a forum for her views. How nauseating. Clearly, she has forgotten that it's not about her views but encouraging the students to evaluate, synthesize, and apply. The student is sacred not her vanity.
I present as many different points as I can in class from a variety of people. I once team taught a history of religions unit which had several guest speakers including a Buddhist monk, an evangelical minister, an atheist and an Imam. During elections we've had people come in from all over the political spectrum. But the students, not the adults, debate, reflect, and discuss. I'm not there to wank my own political rag. Honestly, that teacher should be fired.
Did these friends of yours also lose millions of dollars on credit default swaps and Enron derivitives like you?
"I can't help but think about how those were items #1 and #2 on the list in Germany circa 1933."
So which of the two is #1 for today's government? And do they have their #1 yet? Do they have the #2 as well?
Oh, and Godwin's law is nicely fulfilled... grats.
Did these friends of yours also lose millions of dollars on credit default swaps and Enron derivitives like you
I didn't lose millions. I lost 40 thousand dollars. My grandmother lost more. But people in this country did lose millions...their homes...their retirements...everything. And yet, somehow, it's not the fault of guys like Joe Cassano, Dick Fulds, or Lloyd Blankfein. It's the fault of the people. What a sad fucking myth that will seemingly never die.
Oh, and Godwin's law is nicely fulfilled... grats.
I think Godwin's law has become a nice cover to justify their fascist tendencies. So, I don't give a shit about Godwin's law. If someone is fiercely nationalistic, xenophobic, racist, militaristic, paranoid, and want to destroy the media and the education system, then they are acting exactly as the Nazis did in the 1930s. I'm no longer going to allow the false protection of Godwin's law from people who are very, very frightening.
In other words, if you don't want to be called a fascist, stop acting like one.
Mark, you need a new gym. Seriously.
So anybody who questions your beliefs is a fascist, Mark? Nice case of projection you've got going on there. Sheesh.
Good lord, could you get any more hysterical, Nikto? "Vicious" attacks, "revoking right to organize"? Puh-lease.
And, sure, Romney would've supported the healthcare plan. Duh. But most Republicans 10-15 years ago? What, were you born in 1993 and that's why you have no recollection of the Clinton healthcare fiasco?
There have been no civil trials of Guantanamo detainees
Not for lack of trying, O Absent-Minded One.
Save your spittle-flecked rants for when you have some grasp of reality.
I lost 40 thousand dollars.
In credit default swaps or other hedge instruments?
It's the fault of the people.
The myth is that it is the fault of anyone. Didja father never teach ya "shit happens"?
if you don't want to be called a fascist, stop acting like one.
What I want to know is how I can be an anarchist and a fascist - all at the same time.
No, Larry. I encourage people to question my ideas. That's why I don't delete any comments (save obvious spam) on here. I'm simply pointing out the similarities and where this could lead.
I haven't seen any thoughts on here that would lead me to believe that anyone here is like Katie. No way is juris a fascist. And I think I've seen enough posts from Hap, 6Kings, and Larry to see that they are more of the libertarian bend. I know last personally so no way with him as well.
It's that conformity and nationalist chest thumping that gets me worried. One other thing she went on about is how American should never have to apologize for anything. VERY scary...
I haven't seen any thoughts on here that would lead me to believe that anyone here is like Katie.
Then what is the fucking point of talking about her? I can only conclude it is because it turns you on and gives you a convenient excuse to rant rather than actually discuss. What other reason is there?
fiercely nationalistic
xenophobic
racist
militaristic
paranoid
and want to destroy the media and the education system
------------------------
Who exactly are you hanging out with? Are you actually describing a person you know? Do you know a bunch of them?
Because -as a "conservative"- I've never met someone like that. And I know a great many people.
If it happens that you really don't know anyone like that (or hopefully not many anyway) then perhaps you need to rethink exactly what you think.
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